Speaker 0:01

Welcome to The Heart-Led Business Show, where compassion meets commerce and leaders lead with love. Join your host, Tom Jackobs, as he delves into the insightful conversations with visionary business leaders who defy the status quo, putting humanity first and profit second. From heartfelt strategies to inspiring stories, this podcast is your compass in the world of conscious capitalism. So buckle up and let your heart guide your business journey.

Meet Dr. Ryan Polselli

Tom Jackobs 0:36

Today, we're shining the spotlight on the inspiring Dr. Polselli, a board-certified breast radiologist who flipped the script on traditional care with innovative ideas brewing brighter than the morning coffee. So Ryan bootstrapped Mammolink, ushering a new era of breast cancer screening with heart. So join us as we dive into his journey of building not just a business, but a beacon of hope. Let's get ready to explore the heart of entrepreneurship. Ryan, welcome to the show.

Ryan Polselli 1:07

Hey, thank you, Tom. It's a pleasure to be here.

Tom Jackobs 1:10

It's so good to have you here as well. When you first approached me about the show, I was, at first I was like I'm not quite sure." But then once we had first initial conversation, I was like, "Yes, absolutely. I have to have Ryan onto the show." Our listeners are gonna really enjoy, today's episode and, definitely your journey into entrepreneurship.

Ryan Polselli 1:28

Happy to be here. Happy to share.

Tom Jackobs 1:29

Yeah.

What Defines a Heart-Led Business?

Tom Jackobs 1:30

Awesome. Well, my first question always is, what's your definition of a heart-led business?

Ryan Polselli 1:36

Yeah. I love this question. I've been thinking about it. You hear everybody they have these different things that they say about their business, and I think they all kind of reflect what a heart-led business is, right? Whether it's, you know, Steve Jobs, "Well, if you do what's right on the top line, the bottom line will follow," right? So he's leading with the heart of the product and, and you hear all these various versions of it. For me, the one that, that I think summarizes it is something I've said recently. It just kinda came to me. I said, "This is bigger than me." And so, so to me that's what we're building here is bigger than me, meaning that it doesn't matter what I think about, my free time or my profits or whatever the case may be. This is something that needs to be done. And the good thing about that too is if you think about it through that lens, doesn't matter if you fail either. And so it gives you a freedom, that you can make decisions. You're not worried about the failure. You're just looking on what needs to be done, and I think that gives you a nice focus. Um, but really that has to just come from the heart. And so to me that's the definition.

Taking the Leap Into Entrepreneurship

Tom Jackobs 2:37

Nice. so how have you put that into practice?

Ryan Polselli 2:40

Um, well, I think the first part was, being able to take on this project and 'cause you, you first have to say, "Okay, well, there's a significant risk that this won't work, that I'm gonna lose a, a crap ton of money that I've worked so hard to..." That my wife is gonna be unhappy, and, it's gonna affect my children's savings, and all those things that you think about. And but, you say, The mission is more important and so let's do it." And so that was the first thing, is actually enabling me to take the risk and to, and to go down this path. then, of course there's other things that happen along the way that you have to do as part of your business that maybe you don't really like to do. I'm not generally the most extroverted person in the world. there's parts of this job which, educating the, the partners and, and, there's conferences and things that have to happen. So you have to get up and speak do things like podcasts. And so, even though it maybe isn't my first choice, again, this is bigger than me, so here we are. And, and I think that helps you, have a good center and a good perspective, and it enables you to do all the things that you need to do to eventually be successful.

Tom Jackobs 3:41

Yeah. Yeah, definitely. what are the stats that, one in 10 businesses fail within the first year?

Ryan Polselli 3:48

Oh, yeah.

Tom Jackobs 3:49

Something like that.

Ryan Polselli 3:49

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 3:49

Yeah, it's definitely a upward battle, but I think you're right. When you have that passion, when you have that purpose and you think about the greater good that you're doing with the business, it helps kind of alleviate some of those fears and, sometimes you gotta ignore the stats, right? And just go for it.

Ryan Polselli 4:07

Yeah, exactly. You know what? It doesn't matter. This needs to be done. And, most of the time you think you can do it but you're always aware of that, that super, um, present risk. And so, yeah, it does. It frees you up completely

Tom Jackobs 4:19

That's awesome.

Building a Patient-First Business

Tom Jackobs 4:20

So tell us a little bit about the business first of all, and then your journey into the business

Ryan Polselli 4:25

Yeah. So while we are, uh, you know, the outward appearance is that we're a mobile mammogram company, which I think is a disservice to what we're actually doing. we're a patient-centric company first, and the mobile is an extension of that. So essentially, you know, being from the traditional healthcare system, what I was dealing with day in and day out, was a system that says, "We're the center. You come to us. You do everything that we say you need to do. And if you do it right, we'll take care of you. And if you don't, you're non-compliant. Um, you're a bad patient. Um, you know, why didn't you do this?" Uh, and I just-- it-- something about it rubbed me the wrong way, especially because, my specialty is breast cancer screening, which is supposed to be, you want people to come, you want to make it easy. And so there was this, this huge conflict, and it was, it was obvious to me. And, eventually I got to the point where, it's something I've always wanted to do, but you, you can't just jump in and do it if you don't have the money, you don't have the experience, you don't have the time. So finally, I reached the point where I was like, "Okay, this is possible, and now's the time and, and we should do it." Um, you know, took the risk. Um, everything was, was bootstrapped, so of course, you know, you tap into your savings and, you know, you have those, those moments of, "Oh my God, what have I just done?" But um, you know, you just keep trudging forward day after day and eventually try to build what it is that you think should have been built originally. And so that's what we've been trying to do. one by one, put the pieces together. Look at this basically from the patient point of view. Um, you know, if I was a patient, what would I want? I'd want it easy. I wouldn't want to have somebody say, "Well, we can't see you for three weeks." Or somebody to tell me, "Well, do you have a script?" "Well, no." "Then why are you calling us? Call back later when you do." Or, "Oh, you don't have your medical records? Well, you go pick them up." Or, um, you know, whatever the case may be. I call the, traditional system, it's-- there's a better term out there, but I've always just labeled it the pushback system because I feel like that's what it is to patients. Um, and so, uh, so we're trying to do the opposite of that. That's in a nutshell.

Creating Better Continuity of Care

Tom Jackobs 6:27

So at the core of it, the delivery mechanism is mobile mammogram screening.

Ryan Polselli 6:33

Correct. Yeah. I mean, we do have-- we have a, you know, we're, we're just launching our first brick-and-mortar. Um, and the purpose of that is the continuity of care. So the mobile screening solves a lot of things, but then what, what happens when the patient does have cancer? Well, now they've got to see a surgeon. They've got to... So we're having that transition where we have, a unit which is in conjunction with a really good breast surgeon in the area. So then they have that, what's the next step? It's quick. It's easy. and so we've solved that problem. But the original and the largest problem that we saw was just on the screening side, and the mobile really solved, a lot, a big piece of that, at least the geographic piece.

Tom Jackobs 7:08

And And how long has the business been open?

Ryan Polselli 7:11

So we're just about to enter our third year. Uh, I mean, fourth year, sorry. We're just finishing up our third year, just about to enter our fourth year. Correct. So, um, and not that long. Um, I mean, in some ways it feels like ages, and then in other ways it feels like it was just yesterday.

Tom Jackobs 7:26

Yeah. That's great.

Ryan Polselli 7:27

Yeah. Yeah

Tom Jackobs 7:28

Yeah, kind of over the hump or kind of in that hump right now.

Ryan Polselli 7:31

There's still a hump. There's still things that we're getting over. But, um, yeah, I mean, I feel like, um, especially in the last six months, we've just finally gotten over that hump of, uh, you know, and we're able to now worry less about surviving and look more towards, um, excelling

Scaling a Mission-Driven Company

Ryan Polselli 7:48

and thriving.

Tom Jackobs 7:48

is that scaling, is that a part of it as well as scaling up and banding?

Ryan Polselli 7:53

Correct. Yep. Yep. Yeah. I mean, You know, what's weird is in the very beginning, and, you know, I look back now and I was like, "You probably were a little bit delusional," but I always had this idea that this could be nationwide and we could, we could have this and maybe worldwide. And back then when I'd say things like that, people would laugh. We built everything with the idea that we could scale, so that we're lucky in that way because, nowadays with modern technology, so we have a great technology base, a good layer, laid everything down as if this could be a huge company. So we don't have to backtrack much, which is nice. A lot of it's been paid forward. But, the goal right now is to, systematize everything and then scale.

Tom Jackobs 8:28

Nice. And how many units do you have?

Ryan Polselli 8:31

Five. we're purchasing our sixth this week, maybe our seventh next week. And then if we're lucky, yeah, so we applied to the Rural Health Transformation Program grant, which will be great 'cause this will give us an opportunity to reach more people kind of in areas that are not traditionally, been able to reach. We're waiting on the decision. I think it's 50/50, but if that comes through, that's at three more, so we'd be at 10, hopefully. Fingers crossed. Yeah

The Logistics Behind Mobile Healthcare

Tom Jackobs 8:54

And, forgive my ignorance. Are these buses or are they truck.

Ryan Polselli 8:58

I don't know what to call myself sometimes. And you, do you call it a mobile unit, an RV, a bus? Exactly. Some people call them mammo vans. yeah, I really wish we had a better, a better word for it, but, essentially these are medical grade, RVs that have been converted to, serve the purpose of medical treatment. They're like maybe 40 feet. Yeah. Pop outs, everyone has about five air conditioners, that kind of thing.

Tom Jackobs 9:20

Oh yeah. And the power to.

Ryan Polselli 9:21

Oh my gosh.

Tom Jackobs 9:23

Has to be incredible.

Ryan Polselli 9:24

Yeah. And the cost of diesel right now.

Tom Jackobs 9:28

That's right. yeah, the logistics, I mean, that adds another layer of complexity to it.

Ryan Polselli 9:33

Yeah, that was, that was something that, that, we spent a lot of time on in the very beginning was the logistic. Just working out the logistics. That's been the hard part of it. how do you get images? And, mammo is some of the, the largest images in all of mammography. A lot of people don't know that. But how do you get them off the bus when you have a cellular connection? Just little things like that that people don't think about.

Tom Jackobs 9:53

Oh.

Ryan Polselli 9:53

Don't tap into Wi-Fi or plug in an ethernet cord, so, So we've had to, look around, shop, learn, educate, get some creative systems going and stuff. But, yeah, that was a large part of what we spent most of our time for the first year to two years doing.

Tom Jackobs 10:08

Oh, wow. Probably like five Starlink units on the top.

Ryan Polselli 10:11

We did. We had a combo. We had Starlink at one point. The problem was we... You know, this is, this is, you know, you learn by, by failure and, and trial and error. And it's still a great idea, but, but a lot of the places we would serve, they had trees, buildings downtown, right? And so Starlink was, was-- didn't help us much there. But, uh, we tried.

Tom Jackobs 10:27

It's funny.

Leaving the Security of Traditional Medicine

Tom Jackobs 10:29

So going back before you started the business, you were in traditional, medical care.

Ryan Polselli 10:35

Yeah

Tom Jackobs 10:35

What was the transition like coming out of that and then going into your own business?

Ryan Polselli 10:40

Um, yeah hard. But freeing and liberating at the same time. I got to finally break a lot of the rules that I thought needed to be broken and, um, you know, so it felt good in a way. But at the same time, you know, um, there's a lot of anxiety, there's a lot of worry, there's a lot of fear. I left something that was comfortable. To be in this area of unknown territory and uncertainty, um, all the time, all around you. I heard a really good quote. I forget who it was. I should wish I could give her credit now. But, um, anyway, and she was saying, you know, "Until you've sat in the room at night with your head in your hands, uh, basically, you know, crying about what you've done, uh, you can't really say that, um, you've experienced true entrepreneurship." And I think that's true 'cause, I mean, there are nights that you're just like, "Gosh, what have I done? This is horrible. I should go back," et cetera. But the problem is you're already in. You can't go back. And so there's only one path, and that's forward. And so that's also a, a good thing too, I think, is because, if you can just keep going forward, then you eventually see the light at the end of the tunnel, which is where we are

Tom Jackobs 11:40

Yeah. Well, and especially like we were talking before the show, like that passion and that purpose when it is so crystal clear. Those days, crying yourself to sleep, know, I've had many of those nights as well. Makes it worth it. Like you wake up the next day and you're like, "Okay, you know, pity party's done.. Yeah. Let's move on,"

Ryan Polselli 12:00

Yeah. That's exactly right. Yep. And then you feel good throughout the day and until the next bout comes. Yep.

Tom Jackobs 12:06

Yeah, of course.

Managing the Transition to Entrepreneurship

Tom Jackobs 12:07

Tell me, how long of a transition did you give yourself, or runway did you give yourself from, you know, you had the idea to build the business while you were still employed. So how long did it take yeah finally say that.

Ryan Polselli 12:22

Yeah. I wasn't very sophisticated in terms of planning. It was kind of, fly by the seat of your pants thing. took it just one month at a time. And I said, "You know, well, however long it takes is how long it takes, as long as we're making forward progress every day." And so I guess that would, in one way, was probably pretty good because I didn't put any significant expectations on myself to say, you know, "We haven't reached the milestone. This is failure." for us, yeah, that's, that's essentially what it was. And, and really it was just-- it started off as a very small idea, which was just make it better for the patients. Um, you know, one bus, make it better for the patients, do what we can do. Uh, and then as, you know, it progressed, you know, we saw, okay, other opportunities. This could be this, uh, a little bit bigger in terms of, of our reach, and we can do more here. And so then it just kind of grew out of that. And I still think that, that's kind of the process that's happening right now. Every day there's something new. "Oh my God, we could do this."

Tom Jackobs 13:13

Yeah

Ryan Polselli 13:13

I actually have to slow down the ideas 'cause the, the staff is like, "You know, stop. You're overwhelming us."

Tom Jackobs 13:22

That's a really good indication that you need a good COO to kind of operate for you. 'Cause, I'm the same way. Like my staff just gets like, "Okay, like is this important?" Or you... Now they've gotten to the point where like, "Okay, so, so you're just brainstorming right now, right?"

Ryan Polselli 13:38

Right.

Tom Jackobs 13:39

Of course I'm brainstorming."

Ryan Polselli 13:40

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 13:41

I don't want you to do this right now." "Why wouldn't we do this?" Like, "we should do this, and this." And they're like, "Ugh."

Ryan Polselli 13:46

it's torture though to keep it inside, isn't it? Because you have all the... And you just wanna go and act on it. And so I've had to dial that back in just so I don't create confusion with them and it's terrible. So I have to have an outlet, so I'll put it on a list or I'll write it down, or so it's just a growing list and I try not to overwhelm them, but it's hard not to.

Tom Jackobs 14:06

Like an entrepreneurial group that understand what you're going through so that, you can just pick up the phone and it's like, "Dude, this is going on in my business right now. what's-- what do you think I should do?"

Ryan Polselli 14:16

Yeah. That's a really good point. Yeah. And I think that's why Instagram Reels now, like, right, all the, the startups and the people talking about their struggles and everything, it's therapy for me. You know, 30 minutes at night listening to founders' stories and stuff. it's refreshing. Oh, okay, I'm not alone.

Tom Jackobs 14:31

Yeah. The Doom Scroll Of Founders doom, right?

Ryan Polselli 14:34

Yeah. And they found me.

Tom Jackobs 14:37

Yeah. That's great. so long did it take you to transition?

Ryan Polselli 14:41

I consider now I'm still transitioning, so, every day. But, I kept one foot in, all right? In terms of making sure I had the income. Um, you know, a lot of people say burn the boats so you don't have a choice. I don't think that's the right thing to do. And, and had I done that, we probably would have failed because I needed the income from what I was doing. And that was hard too, because you're working in one and doing another, and there's competing interests and, and even people that know what you're doing, they're like, "Wait, you're working here and now you're competing against us," and raised a whole nother level of issues. But I was lucky enough to be able to navigate that and, keep one foot in. And I still have, one foot, in there. And so I still have another source of income, which is in the traditional reading, just to make sure that, God forbid there's any kind of, difficulty, diesel prices go any higher, something happens. You just never know. It's your responsibility now because I got people that depend on us, right? To pay their bills and for their kids and everything else. And so, I wanna make sure that, that's always there for them.

Tom Jackobs 15:35

Yeah. No, that, that's smart. So I was in corporate for 10 years, 12 years, and when I transitioned out, I took a good year to do that transsition. And was like, you, one foot in, on both and long days.

Ryan Polselli 15:50

Yeah. It's a real thing.

Tom Jackobs 15:52

Yeah. That's the more what I consider more responsible because if you go out and you don't, one, you don't have the backing or you're bootstrapping things, that stress of not knowing where your next paycheck is gonna come from.

Ryan Polselli 16:05

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 16:06

Or that next deal, that can make you make bad decisions.

Ryan Polselli 16:10

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 16:11

Yeah.

Ryan Polselli 16:12

Very good point. Very good point.

Making Tough Decisions Under Pressure

Tom Jackobs 16:14

That when things like that happen? Like in terms of decision-making when under stress

Ryan Polselli 16:22

Yeah. That comes up, actually comes up a lot, especially the, the financial decisions that need to be made. I don't think there's any easy way to do it. Um, you know, uh, and I think that, um, I think having a good center and a good focus on what you know needs to be done and you just have to have a lot of faith and you have to be willing to take the risk and just suck it up and go for it. And that's what we do. And then you just hope that, down the road it's, it's less risk and less worry each time. And, uh, you know, slowly we're getting there 'cause, you know, the bigger you get the more opportunities you have for, pedal of support to be knocked out from under you and, and still survive. So, it's more work and it's more complicated, but at the same time it, it gives you that stability and, and honestly, the work isn't the hard part. It's the worry, the anxiety, the knowing that... the uncertainty that for me at least, that's the hard part, you know?

Tom Jackobs 17:09

Yeah. Well, for most people, I think is that, that uncertainty. And I think that's what drives a lot of entrepreneurs is that uncertainty, it takes its toll at the same time.

Ryan Polselli 17:20

It does. It does. Yeah. My hair is a lot whiter than it used to be. Went quick.

Tom Jackobs 17:26

Yes. Well,

Ryan Polselli 17:27

Yeah, exactly. I mean, I think there's a reason why you see, presidents, they look really good, and they get in the presidency, and two years later they're completely gray.

Tom Jackobs 17:35

Oh, yeah.

Ryan Polselli 17:36

If they're not color- Yeah

Tom Jackobs 17:38

Yeah. Exactly.

A Mission Bigger Than Business

Tom Jackobs 17:40

Cool. So when you're, going through and you're three years into it,

Ryan Polselli 17:45

Mm-hmm.

Tom Jackobs 17:45

what are the big plans then, that keep you driving towards, your ultimate goals? And what's driving you there?

Ryan Polselli 17:54

Yeah. Um, I think about it less and less because it's just kind of taken over, but it's still that mission. It's still the belief that this can be, um, really big and transformative. Now, that's kind of the-- I've stepped back a, a lot and now I'm looking at this more, more globally, you know, in terms of, you know, well, we could actually have the opportunity to change the system. So now I'm thinking in terms of lives, right? And so, I guess 30. It's debatable, 30, 35 million women a year don't get screened annually. 40,000 women a year still dying of a disease that is largely preventable with good screening. So there's a long way to go. And so I'm thinking about those numbers now, and I'm thinking about how this could actually really significantly cut down on that if we can do it. so that's what's keeping me motivated at this point.

Tom Jackobs 18:40

That is 30 million do not get Screened.

Ryan Polselli 18:43

Isn't that crazy? You're over 300 million, but it's a lie. Yeah. I mean, some studies Estimate you could... here's the thing, it's misleading. If you go to the government studies, they're gonna show you that the compliance is like 80, 90%, but they're looking at a 27-month compliance rate and, you know, that's not enough to, say annual screening. So, a lot of them are just getting into the 27th month just to make the measure to get the reimbursement and the subsidies from the government.

Tom Jackobs 19:06

Okay. So, so they're counting the 27 months as an annual goal?

Ryan Polselli 19:10

Yeah, it's... You know how it is.

Tom Jackobs 19:12

Yeah, exactly. Awesome.

Scaling Beyond One State

Tom Jackobs 19:15

So what's next for you in terms of the growth of the business?

Ryan Polselli 19:19

Um, hopefully, you know, another state. That's our next one. And hopefully if the bus comes through like we're thinking in the next week or two, then, um, that'll be our first, um, move into another state. Yeah, I think we've proven everything works in Florida. So, now we get to test other areas. So we're gonna find places that are favorable and get a foothold. The concept is to seed, so find a, a few big cities around that we can actually, plant this and then reproduce the model.

Tom Jackobs 19:45

Yeah.

Ryan Polselli 19:46

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 19:46

Yeah. Does the licensure, does that cause any type of complication?

Ryan Polselli 19:51

Licensure in every state for the physicians that read for you is like, I'll have to, you know, there's, there's not... Well, there is, but it's not really universal or widely accepted yet. A system where if you're a licensed physician in Florida, you can work in other states. It's not really that well, accepted yet. So generally that, and then also too, you gotta get brand new insurance contracts everywhere you go, every state. So, and that's the big one. That's the biggest one. There's some-- In some states they're closed, and if they're closed, you just don't... We struggled with that in Florida. They were closed for, you know, some of them for, you know, we, we were trying to get insurance contracts for like five years. Yeah. Horrible. Um, yeah, the last couple was a, a letter to the board and a lobbyist on, in the, uh, the capital here in Florida. So yeah, I mean, that's the kind of effort it took to finally get in.

Tom Jackobs 20:37

Wow.

Ryan Polselli 20:38

Yeah. Yeah, it'll be a big deal. Big pain in the butt, but.

Tom Jackobs 20:42

You would think, but the insurance companies, they would want more access so that, later down the road they're not paying them a million dollars for cancer treatment

Ryan Polselli 20:52

That is a conundrum. So you're absolutely right, and, it took me a long time to realize why this was happening. And generally, though, we do have an easier job with the insurance companies because I do think they, they do understand that and they get that. Uh, but, you know, things are so bureaucratic now. There's so many, many departments and everything, so-- And, and one part doesn't talk to the other and, Really, we're most successful the higher you go up the chain of command. And so if you reach somebody that's at a higher level, they're like, "Yep, makes sense. Let's go ahead and do it." But if you're trying to do it at the lower levels where the entry level, where the things come in, it just-- you just get blocked.

Tom Jackobs 21:26

Yeah

Ryan Polselli 21:27

And another piece of that is, the average person only stays with an insurance company a, a few years. And so, the long-term savings comes from your-- or I guess the savings from, from screening is more of a long-term benefit. So why invest all the money for a turnover that's gonna happen in two years? We're not gonna reap it. And so we almost have to say, make it a collective thing, and then it makes sense to everybody. But yeah.

Tom Jackobs 21:50

Now when they have their own board and their own president that's making, you know.

Ryan Polselli 21:54

Exactly. Yep. Yep.

Tom Jackobs 21:57

That could be a whole another show actually.

Ryan Polselli 21:58

It could be, yeah.

Connect with Dr. Ryan Polselli

Tom Jackobs 22:00

But no, Ryan, this is, your journey, like I said at the beginning of the show, is just absolutely fascinating. I'm so glad that you've been on the show as, today as well. But tell us, how can people learn more about your company and you and the great work that you're doing?

Ryan Polselli 22:14

Um, you know, the easiest way is, um, Ryan Polselli, just my name. I'm on, uh, social media now, um, you know, LinkedIn, Instagram, uh, Facebook or mammolink.com. It's easy, just one word, which is our, our company's name. And, uh, and from there you'll see plenty of opportunities to connect, email, whatever the case may be. I think my phone number's out there somewhere.

Tom Jackobs 22:38

Yeah, probably.

Ryan Polselli 22:39

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 22:40

Awesome. I'll all that in the show notes as well so sure can, get a hold of you and click away and look at the website.

Ryan Polselli 22:47

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 22:48

If they need some help, they can, uh, contact. That's awesome.

Ryan Polselli 22:51

Yeah. Thank you, Tom.

Tom Jackobs 22:52

Thank you so much for being on the show and sharing your journey and your transformation.

Ryan Polselli 22:56

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs 22:56

I really do appreciate it.

Ryan Polselli 22:57

Yeah. This has been great, Tom. Thank you so much.

Final Thoughts & Outro

Tom Jackobs 23:00

Awesome. Thank you. Thank you show listeners for tuning in today. We really do appreciate you. And, uh, make sure you're checking out everything that Ryan's doing. We're gonna put all that down into the show notes and, uh, all the links and all that good stuff, so make sure you're checking that out. And if you could do a solid for us here at the show, If you could just give the show a good rating and review, I'd really appreciate that. Just help spread the word about more entrepreneurs that are putting heart into their business, and we definitely need more of that in this world today. So until next time, lead with your heart.

Speaker 2 23:32

You've been listening to The Heart-Led Business Show, hosted by Tom Jackobs. Join us next time for another inspiring journey into the heart of business.