Speaker: 0:01

Welcome to The Heart-Led Business Show, where compassion meets commerce and leaders lead with love. Join your host, Tom Jackobs, as he delves into the insightful conversations with visionary business leaders who defy the status quo, putting humanity first and profit second. From heartfelt strategies to inspiring stories, this podcast is your compass in the world of conscious capitalism. So buckle up and let your heart guide your business journey.

Tom Jackobs: 0:36

Welcome back to the heart-led business show where passion meets purpose, and today we're graced with the fitness fanatic himself, John Heringer. With over 20 years crafting champions at Method3 Fitness and a dynamic team of 17 dedicated pros, he's turned sweat into smiles and goals, into gains. When he is not empowering nearly 600 clients. You can find him sharing quality time with his amazing wife, Sarah, and his rockstar sons, Jackson, Brennan, and Ryland. Join us as we delve into John's heart-led journey and explore the magic of building a business that truly cares. John, welcome to the show.

John Heringer: 1:17

Thank you, sir. Pleasure to be here, Tom.

Tom Jackobs: 1:19

I am really excited about this conversation today because John, we've known each other for probably 15, 16 years when we both had our own fitness business. Well, I sold out. You'll still have yours,

John Heringer: 1:32

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs: 1:32

20 years. That's incredible journey. Especially in the personal training and fitness world. So I'm super excited to dive into that. But of course, the first question I always like to ask is, what's your definition of a heart-led business?

John Heringer: 1:47

So I think my definition of a heart-led business would be one that is led, cultivated has a foundation built upon relationships. When we dove into kind of what makes Method3 really special and unique, when we really drill down we find that it is all, it all starts with relationships, whether that's with our partners, that's what we call our clients or with our teammates.

Tom Jackobs: 2:09

I really love that because at the crux of any business, there has to be a relationship because at the end of the day, we do business with other people. And as, as people, we like relationships most of the time anyway.

John Heringer: 2:23

Most of the time. Yep. Yep, exactly.

Tom Jackobs: 2:27

Tell us about your journey into Method3, like maybe what you've done before, Method3, and what got you into personal training and the fitness business.

John Heringer: 2:37

Totally. Let's see. I'll try to make this a blitz through time. So actually, wanted to be originally an attorney. International Corporate law was gonna be the name of the game. Was bent on that since like high school. And then while at Santa Barbara, that's where I did my undergrad. I studied political science and Spanish kind of continuing on that route. And but I got a minor basically in personal training as well. And I just loved those classes. Nutrition and anatomy and fizz and kines and all these great classes. And it was my kinesiology professor Romeo, who got me excited about just health and fitness as an actual career. But I stayed on this journey of, Nope, I'm gonna take the LSATs, I'm gonna apply to law school. And then it was really when I graduated, right when I graduated. About to say, cool, I'll go to this law school. And I just had this epiphany of you know what, I envision myself being an attorney in 30 years, but I can envision myself being a coach. So that was a, an interesting conversation with my parents dad, who was let's rethink this a little bit. Mom, who was like, oh, you're young. Just what does your heart tell you to do? Go for it. You can always go be an attorney if it doesn't workout out. And so it was kinda like cool. Okay, dad, thanks. And then it was, okay, mom, that's what I wanted to hear. Thanks. But they were both super supportive and I started at literally at front desk at just a local, gym.

Tom Jackobs: 3:58

Yeah.

John Heringer: 3:59

Ended up, becoming certified, working my way up within that, more of the health Cub kind of big box gym. It was a place called the right stuff health clubs actually.

Tom Jackobs: 4:07

The right stuff.

John Heringer: 4:08

The right stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, I worked my way up in the healthcare industry for about five years and just some things transpired and changed for me within the structure that I was like, you know what? I think I'd rather just go try this on my own. And at that time the company was actually called Fast Action Training, so I started that on the side. Yep. And then was

Tom Jackobs: 4:30

Wait, what was the, sorry, but what was the slogan for FAT?

John Heringer: 4:35

Get fit with fat. That's right. Yep. FAT. Yeah. My, my clients back then would lovingly say that they were going to their fat class for the day. And I'm like, I don't think that was, in retrospect, really should have thought this through here. The acronym might not serve me well, but I will say it was memorable at the very least right?

Tom Jackobs: 4:55

If done the PHAT that would've.

John Heringer: 4:57

I should have done that. Yep. Yep. And then, I've always been a huge fan of marketing and sales and actually that's not true. I'll, let me back up. I wasn't always a biggest fan of marketing and sales. Learned to love sales and then became a, just a student of it, student of marketing. We crossed paths back in the NPE days and really fell in love with all those things. But I, we got lucky enough to be featured on Groupon. And so, I know there's probably a variety of people watching this, but in the States huge thing that back in the day before it became a conglomerate of multiple different deals you could get. They had a daily deal and it was just one email blast that went out. And it was, obviously I think back then it got a crazy valuation'cause it grew so fast, Groupon and, But we were lucky enough to be featured. We sold a bunch that gave me the opportunity. The way they paid out back then was a third, right when the deal closed a third, 30 days later and a third, 30 days after that. From a budgeting perspective, it actually really helped me. And it was like if any time we're a time and this were a sign, this is it. So I'm gonna go for it. So I quit my full-time coaching gig that I was doing at the time,'cause I had just gone back to the personal training went on into fast action training. At the time we were just subleasing a space. Lucky enough to have a lot of people come in. Redeem their Groupon, flip them into, ongoing training thereafter. And it was a funny time, Tom, because where I was subleasing from was a tanning and fitness like space. It was called eclipse tanning and fitness. So the funny thing was, is I'm literally doing consults with people on this couch.'cause I didn't have an office. And the fitness space is attached to this tanning salon. I'm doing consults on this couch as people are coming in and getting their tan on. And it was just a funny thing to have this kind of look, tell me about your goals. And someone's like, yeah, I'll get 15 in the standup. And it's like just comical that it was, you know, I'm like trying to be serious in this environment, but, I love reminiscing about those times and just, it may, it helps maintain a sense of humility of the grassroots of how we started and never taking anything for granted. So fast forward, we were there for about a year. We continued to grow. We then located a space and we've now been in business about 15 years. We just celebrated our 15 year anniversary. We had a huge turnout. It was absolutely awesome to celebrate and just reminded me I spoke about my definition is, heart-led business is built on relationships, and ultimately that's what I got to see, just inaction. Our team connecting our team, connecting with our partners. That's what we call our, we call our members partners and we call our memberships partnerships because we think it's two way street to get them where they wanna go.

Tom Jackobs: 7:36

Love that.

John Heringer: 7:37

Yeah, so it was just a beautiful time. We did it at this cool bocce place. We had a bunch of food catered in and just had some fun, unique gifts. We gave various people and got to celebrate a few 15 year partners. So we literally have, now, I think. Four. We've celebrated five 15 year partners, so people that have literally been with me since almost the very, very beginning.

Tom Jackobs: 8:02

Wow.

John Heringer: 8:02

Which is just incredible and it's so fun to share that. I'll have to send you afterwards. Something we do is we started a few years back, which is an annual like Method3 magazine. And it's like a year in review. And our marketing coordinator, Shannon, does an absolutely incredible job. Just showcasing what we did for the year as a group partners different stories that we have, team things. It's just an incredible magazine. I think people now really look forward to it. Fun to, to celebrate.'cause some of these partners have been with us like a year and they're like, wait. You just celebrated 15. And so I it's awesome because we've obviously done a great job cultivating these relationships and helping people wanna be a part of something and a community and all these different factors. But I think it also then shows people that are coming in, wow, this is like a place I could just call home. An amazing journey. Yeah. To say the least.

Tom Jackobs: 8:55

Yeah. That is amazing. Yeah. And I'm totally with you on the reminiscing and the Groupon day. I remember when we were listed on Groupon as well in my fitness center. The phone would not stop ringing. And I was like, hands on deck. Crazy. It's so good.

John Heringer: 9:12

Yeah.

Tom Jackobs: 9:13

And then it wasn't.

John Heringer: 9:14

And then it wasn't. The correct. Yeah. As many from marketing things can be sometimes. Yeah.

Tom Jackobs: 9:18

Yeah. Yeah. So it's interesting, like how did you like get away from the law, and thinking about being a lawyer and an attorney, and then shifting to fitness because it's so very different. Is it you're leading with your heart. Like I always envisioned, you're helping people change their lives in a very positive way with fitness, international law. That's cool and stuff, but is it really working with a lot of people.

John Heringer: 9:48

Makes for a fun topic, whenever I get to meet people at a different, like a dinner party or something, and it's like, what do you do? I do fitness and we'll dive into a little bit of the backstory of it and they're like. it's a great icebreaker on some things. I think growing up my, my dad was a doc actually was an ER doc, and then he opened up in an urgent care and family care practice. So the entrepreneurial spirit runs in the family. Mom was a nurse, and so an attorney just fit into the, like safe career, professional career. And truly I've always had a more. Analytical mind than a creative one. And I love languages. I love languages. I love Spanish. I still speak Spanish to this day.

Tom Jackobs: 10:28

Bueno.

John Heringer: 10:28

I, yeah, Ci, Muy Bueno, Ci and I think it just it just fit at the time. And then when I was in college, I just, I had started literally, I think in high school getting into, working out, really got into health and wellness for myself. Saw the changes it made in me, saw the performance changes, that occurred when I would, I did swimming in water polo.

Tom Jackobs: 10:50

Wow.

John Heringer: 10:50

And the ability to like train to do these things and help have them improve my sport performance. So that just got me really excited about all of it. And so then when I got to go further that education in college, just for, at that time really just for fun. It made me realize how passionate I really was about it. And then all I had in my head was that I wanted to own my own gym. That was it. And so in the health club industry, that kind of presented a possibility. At the time when I resigned, actually I was, I was operating one and overseeing two others, so I was, i'd say really at that time I was more of a regional person. Regional manager of sorts without really any like ownership or interest or equity. And to be honest, I knew I really wanted to do things differently and have it be less of a big gym that people come into and more of one that was built upon these relationships that, if you didn't come into the studio, we were gonna know and you would hear from us versus, Hey, if we don't hear from them, that's okay, because they're still paying their dues. So I think it was, it was, when I tell people the story, it sounds very odd, but, along the way, I just built this growing love for all things health and wellness. And I think even now, we've had Method3 for 15 years. My wife and I had bought into an awesome franchise, had two locations there, just recently sold those. Honestly the thing that's always remained the same is this love for health and wellness. Whether it's now biohacking on myself and diving deep and then sharing these things with my coaches and, we just went to idea the big Health and wellness conference. They had their idea world Conference. Just up here in Sacramento California. So I lived just outside of Sacramento. My studio is actually in the Bay Area in San Jose. It's about two and a half, three hours away. So I don't go down there that much at all. I go down there about once a month or so and just connect with the team remotely. So but I got to bring the whole team up and it was just such a great experience. Got him in a hotel, had big team dinner. Everyone's doing different educational sessions, and then we come back to the studio. Now they're doing teachbacks for each other. So we're all just improving this awesome sense of learning, and I love it. And we've just provided a place for coaches to really thrive. And whether that's from education or just being able to be awesome at their craft and it's a, yeah, it's a really a special place. I'm biased, but it's special.

Tom Jackobs: 13:09

It's a testament to be in business for 15 years. Like most businesses don't make it the first year, let alone five or even 10. So kudos to you for sticking with it because I'm sure first of all, like taking care of your employees is so important because they're the ones that are taking care of the clients.

John Heringer: 13:29

Correct.

Tom Jackobs: 13:30

And if you don't taking, and so it's brilliant the way that you've structured that to keep, the what do you call the employees or

John Heringer: 13:38

we, I just call'em teammates. We're all teammates? But we call our members parters.

Tom Jackobs: 13:43

Partners, yeah. So the teammates are taking care of the partners, and the partners are ultimately taking care of the whole business because they keep coming back for more. To have somebody that's, five people that have been there for 15 years. That's amazing.

John Heringer: 13:56

We had just a partner that I connect. We have a our own little show called The Stronger for Today show that we interview, different people and a lot of them are partners to share some of their stories for the older adult that's were trying to share and show, how when you, it's never too late to start in some of these journeys and what it can do for not just improving your lifespan, but your health span, right? The enjoyment of those years. I got to connect with one of our female partners her name is Anne. She just finished an incredible hike The Himalayas.

Tom Jackobs: 14:27

Oh my God.

John Heringer: 14:27

Went up to I don't even know, 15,000 feet or something. 14,000 feet. And one of the things she shared though, is she's gotten so much out of her partnership with us and her coach, Justin and all these things. But what really struck her that she shared with me, which I thought was, it's, it was great'cause it's literally our goal and that I tell our, I tell people when they joined with us and I tell, our team is like, we want through our actions. We want our partners to understand that they are more important, their goals are more important, their success is more important than the money that they're investing in us. And it was so awesome because this girl's been with us for about a year. And she literally said that verbatim to me. She's I just feel like everything, every person I connect with, coach, like I can just sense you guys care more about us than you do about the financial, thing that's happening.'cause obviously there's gotta be a transaction there and that's, you gotta be a business. But but I don't even realize that or feel that, I just feel that like, all you care about is us. And I was like mission accomplished. This is great. it was so cool to hear and from a newer person, that's been with us just over a year at that. But I think this that focus and this focus on our team and our partners and really just being, and, slightly insane about how we can serve better, all the time, is what has been a huge piece of our success. And one of the cool things it just did, was I was trying to track our average length of engagement. And it was hovering around, still very strong, but hovering around anywhere from 39 to 41 months.

Tom Jackobs: 15:56

Oh my gosh.

John Heringer: 15:57

And so yes, great. In and of itself.

Tom Jackobs: 16:00

Crazy. Oh my gosh.

John Heringer: 16:02

It's now actually though about 46. So the crazy thing was thinking, wow, we are literally almost, our average length of a client staying with us when they sign up is almost four years.

Tom Jackobs: 16:16

Wow.

John Heringer: 16:17

It was just really cool to go back and see that. And I think part of that is actually a little bit of a segue into personal training. We've now years ago, we used to be more top heavy group to personal training and I'd say now it's definitely more evened out or slightly more personal training than group. And so I think it's been an interesting, but we've done a good job at still having those one-on-one personal training clients. Not just develop a relationship with our coach, but with the community at large.

Tom Jackobs: 16:42

Yeah.

John Heringer: 16:42

and so I think that's been a big piece of helping people wanna stay a part of what we offer besides just the coaching sessions that they're getting. It's more than that.

Tom Jackobs: 16:51

Yeah. Yeah. And that's what I found too, is when you connect people in a kind of a shared goal like fitness or the pain of going through a workout with, a personal trainer, that's a little bit too. But then they're sharing in that experience together, they've cre it automatically creates a community, but then it's also our job as the business owner to set the tone for that to actually happen.

John Heringer: 17:15

Correct.

Tom Jackobs: 17:16

So tell me how do you think that you set that tone from the very beginning to make sure that, fast action training turning into Method3 is, was congruent all the way through.

John Heringer: 17:26

Whew. I'm gonna first say that I made a lot of mistakes and so it's by learning from those mistakes and through people that you realize aren't the best fit as coaches, because ultimately it's, I think that was one of the hardest lessons was how am I gonna duplicate myself?

Tom Jackobs: 17:41

Yeah.

John Heringer: 17:42

Because I can't have this run just on me and you're doing your, I think the first thing is understanding that. No one will be a hundred percent John.

Tom Jackobs: 17:50

Right.

John Heringer: 17:50

And not only is that okay, that's actually probably better because who would want a bunch of the same personalities like completely congruent the whole time? No one. Right? That'd be annoying after a while. So I think that was actually The thing I came to realize is that as I got more people on each, had their own unique strengths, I call'em flare. Everyone's got their own flare. I say, look we're all working, and we literally just talked about this because we had a program design template and everything that we had created together, collaborated on to kind of serve the older adult who we really coach primarily now, like 40, 40, 45, 50 plus. And we gotten away from it. And so we had to circle back and say, okay let's recalibrate this template that we use. To say what are the important pieces that need to take place in terms of someone's program, like mobility, strength, all these pieces, and then the exercises they're in. Here's our exercise library. You can have a few different ones, but let's make sure we're speaking the same language. What you create within that, like the ingredients and the recipe that you create for that client. You and I could create ones that are totally different, but as long as we're going from the same template, from the same exercises, from the same thinking of how to serve this person to keep them safe, but effective. Then we're good. And so I think that was a realization slowly started to occur is I can have all these different people, but as long as we're working within the same framework under the umbrella of Method3 and serving people from a like a company standpoint, not like a John versus Tom versus Bobby versus Sue. It's not individuals. We're a collective. And so I really try to make sure that I'm harnessing that we have weekly team meetings. I'd say it starts from our interview process to make sure that we are, it's a lengthy interview process. We also have something very unique, I'll say, Tom, is that instead of like hourly or commissions or all these things. We literally have a salary, like it's Hey, this is what you're gonna get, paid. We expect you to eventually work up to this many service hours. 25, 30 service hours, you'll get paid for 40. You can do all your program design, you can make sure you're cleaning and taking care of equipment, putting things away if you have extra time, here's a list of, we call'em downtime duties to make sure that you're helping move the needle in some respective way. So that you're not just getting paid for being on the clock for doing nothing just because you have a client canceled. And so that has given our team the ability to like just focus on what they do best. They're not worried about these tumultuous ups and downs in income. What if so and so goes on vacation because our income stays the same? We just may expect them to do some different things while those hours open back up. We offer access to benefits. We have a 401k, we have paid time off. So there's just a lot of things we do a little bit different that gives stability to coaches in an environment and industry where typically that's not the norm. And so I think all those things together have created an atmosphere where they feel, they feel safe, they feel appreciated and they get you to just focus on what they do best with their own respective flare, under the umbrella of Method3. And so it's allow them to really thrive. And create this amazing, we collectively, we create this great community together, and I tell my team all the time, I said, look, I'm blessed that we have this amazing team. I feel equally blessed that we've attracted the right people in as partners. To be a part of this with us, because together we make up this unique thing that is Method3, I always call where we are like the beacon of positivity. Like people are literally drawn to us at Method3 and want to be a part of it.

Tom Jackobs: 21:23

Yeah.

John Heringer: 21:24

But we can only, make sure we gotta make sure it's a good fit, right? As, as both partners coming in, teammates coming in. And I think that's given us the ability, me the ability to step out more and just, lead from more of a visionary sales marketing, process driven standpoint. And allow my team to be the main ones that execute.

Tom Jackobs: 21:40

That's brilliant. And that's what the CEO should be doing too, is setting the tone and direction. So let's shift gears just a little bit and Talk about the business side because we're kinda had the same business for a while. There's challenges probably early on. Around money, and you still wanna be heart-led, but then the bank account is telling you, oh, you need some money. How do you balance the need to making money and profit with still being heart-led, and how do those combine together for you to make such a great business?

John Heringer: 22:13

Yeah, I think I know as coaches we come into this just with this heart of gold. We wanna serve everyone and it's hard to ask for money and then we, all of a sudden we're guilty of saying, oh, I only want to charge Tom this'cause he's great and I know him from before, but Bobby, I don't know. So I'm gonna charge him full price. And that, and it's all these different, I think one, getting some business coaching, I've always been a fan of having a coach to figure out what I need at the time and trying to find a coach that will serve that need. And so I've had, I'd say thankfully I've had a majority of great coaches.

Tom Jackobs: 22:41

Same.

John Heringer: 22:42

Some, that, one or two maybe that I'm like, ah, maybe would've done that different and not signed up for some coaching there. But you still learn through those as well. I think it was coming to the realization that I can't serve people and keep building this amazing community unless, I'm charging what we need to charge and paying my team, a reasonable great wage, especially since it's salary. And then we're taking care of them in a variety of different ways. And the only way to reconcile that is by making sure that we are charging what we should be to maintain profitability'cause if we're out of business, we can't serve anyone. And to be honest, I tell everyone like that would be horrible'cause a light would be extinguished from the earth. And if we're gonna do our damnedest to make a dent in the universe, we can't do it if we're not profitable and not actually like in business. So we definitely did rate increases throughout the years. There were a couple, one or two kind of oh, blank moments, where I had to kinda say, wow, how did I mess up my numbers here? What did I not do? Did I not appropriately say for taxes or think what, whatever it was?

Tom Jackobs: 23:43

Yeah.

John Heringer: 23:44

Those were all things we got to learn through. And I think now, and then the pandemic, honestly, going through the pandemic was literally, it was harder than starting the business going through that. I know it was hard for everyone, but in health and fitness, it was extremely challenging. Specifically where my studio was located in Santa Clara County, in California, it was just completely shut down. And so we had to pivot. We built, we did online. We Built an outdoor training area. We called it the outdoor arena. Literally we did a lot of outdoor sessions for pretty much almost 2 years because it took people, was a little bit of a challenge to coax people out, not because the pandemic in terms of the virus. I'll say maybe some were like that, but more so because they were used to training indoors. And now we're assign to the train outdoors. And we're blessed with pretty much some very good weather, I'll say where we are in San Jose. But literally for 2 years and we were able to, get through the pandemic. And we've literally grown every year since then. And this year we'll be, last year already was, and I think this year will be again, like the best year we've had in 15 years. I feel grateful every day, and I tell my team, I'll never forget the pandemic because it grounds me in humility and gratitude. Also the lessons learned of we will always have a strong, I say strong, very strong cash reserves to float any storm so that there will never be a moment. I'm going, oh no, how are we gonna survive? We will make it through anything. It also really made me a lot more since the pandemic, I think the year after. So 2021 and every year since we've raised our rates, every year

Tom Jackobs: 25:21

Yeah.

John Heringer: 25:22

And that's a such a fear, everything comes down to fear for raising our rates. And I can tell you right now with almost 600 clients, we typically, we'll raise it anywhere, we charge our clients, our partners weekly. So we'll raise it anywhere from 3, 4 to$5 per week.

Tom Jackobs: 25:38

Okay.

John Heringer: 25:38

Part of that is also when we raise it, it sounds like 3 bucks a week. Okay? 12 to$20 a month for a studio. Time is by that many members. That has an impact, right? That allow us to maintain profitability. Great raises to our team but also take care of all the other things, inflation, all the prices that

Tom Jackobs: 25:56

Yeah.

John Heringer: 25:56

increase from our vendors. Electricity as we grow, like all these things, our rent goes up, like all these things

Tom Jackobs: 26:01

Yep.

John Heringer: 26:02

That go up. So you have to raise prices, right? Or else you have a business. And so literally out of all those times we've raised it, I think on average we will lose anywhere from 1 to, I think the max in all the past years, like the past 4 to 5 years has been 5 people,

Tom Jackobs: 26:18

People. Wow.

John Heringer: 26:19

So, 1 to 5

Tom Jackobs: 26:19

Yeah.

John Heringer: 26:20

people out of 550 plus clients.

Tom Jackobs: 26:23

Yeah. That's amazing. That's 0.01.

John Heringer: 26:26

So it's just a fear-based thing and that's allowed us to maintain this getting back to your original question there, to maintain this, like in order for us to fulfill our purpose and have the impact we wanna make, we must maintain profitability. And that means, always evaluating where we're at from that standpoint. As we bring on new people, as we grow, as we look at, acquiring equipment, or getting new space or more space it always has to come down to where does that impact our bottom line? Can we afford this? Can we float this? Does it make sense right now? Is it a now, is it a later? Because if it ever puts us into too much of a precarious position, then it's probably not worth it. Like even right now we're growing. We're gonna need more space, whether it's a completely new space or just acquiring more. But we're going to not do that until we're literally bursting from the seams and figuring out, because then it'll be a much easier way to fall into that new space and afford it and not have any OSH moments. We're just gonna go, okay cool. We accounted for this. Now we have more space to float these people that we were kinda like. Crammed in a little bit on top of each other, but now we're good. We've got the space and we can afford it. So trying to be really intentional about that.

Tom Jackobs: 27:34

That's great'cause all that planning that many small business owners don't really think about. It's all from the seat of your pants and when you put your heart into something, a lot of times you don't always think through all the different consequences. So it's very smart. It's great. So John, tell us it's kinda come to that time, unfortunately, this has been a great conversation. You've shared so much wisdom of your journey, but how can people learn more about you and Method3 Fitness?

John Heringer: 27:59

Method3fitness.com is our website. You're welcome to go there and check out who we are or what we do and how we serve our people. You wanna hit me, with an email, I'm happy to get back if there's anything I can do to assist you on your journey, whoever's watching email's pretty simple. JOHN john@methodthreefitness.com. It's method, it's the number 3, the digit, and then fitness.com.

Tom Jackobs: 28:22

Just like your shirt.

John Heringer: 28:24

That's just like my shirt. That's it. So you can check us out there. Happy to assist on the journey where I can. I think if there's any, no matter what the business is that people are in that are watching this, I think we all have these aspirations as we vision cast. just one, two thing I wanna say about that is just allowing yourself the grace to let that vision evolve. And change but never letting really go of it, right? Because I'll say that as we've gone through now 15 years in, I'm still super passionate. We've got annual planning we're doing with our leadership team next week. I can't wait to figure out how we're gonna continue to climb, get to a thousand partners that we're gonna lead, And then how we now cast our, what we've built out and train people online since that's become such a much more, Easier thing to do for people, even the older adult. So you know, don't let go of the vision. Know that as you progress and climb and you find the right people on your team, it gives you more and more time to then cast that vision and create it and excite your team and row the troops behind that so you can really have the impact you wanna make.

Tom Jackobs: 29:22

that's great advice and we'll make sure to package that up into a nice short that we can publicize, that's absolute gold right there. John, thank you again for being on the show today and sharing your wisdom. We've been friends for a long time and I always appreciate talking to you. You have such a great attitude and your spirit is so much in the heart. So thank you for everything.

John Heringer: 29:41

My pleasure, Tom. Thanks for having me, man. It's been great to wrap with you.

Tom Jackobs: 29:44

Awesome. And thank you dear listeners, for watching today or listening in today on your podcast Player of Choice, and we really do appreciate it. So if you wanna check out everything that John's doing, we're gonna put that all in the show notes. So just check that out down in the show notes. And while you're down there, if you could do us a favor and give a show a rating and a review. Hopefully 5 stars. That definitely spreads the word about the heart-led business show and helps those that want to be more heart-led. Be okay with being heart-led and making a profit. So until next time, lead with your heart.

Speaker 2: 30:16

You've been listening to The Heart-Led Business Show, hosted by Tom Jackobs. Join us next time for another inspiring journey into the heart of business.